004: Brig Leland – The Shirtless Entrepreneur from PivotPass

Title: Brig Leland – The shirtless entrepreneur from PivotPass

Host: Peter Wilson
Guest: Brig Leland

Peter: Welcome to the Biz and Life Done Well podcast, where we explore what it means and what it takes to do business and life well. I’m your host, Peter Wilson. If you’re like me, you’re intrigued by stories of common people who have achieved uncommon success in business and life. Join me as I interview fascinating people about how they got started, their successes and failures, their habits and routines, and what inspires them.

Peter: Today, we are speaking with Brigg Leland of Pivot Pass. I’ve known Brigg for close to a year.

Brig: Well, Peter, first off, I wanna just thank you for inviting me. I’ve really enjoyed, building our relationship and for you to to ask me to, join your podcast is is a great opportunity and so hopefully I can add value to all your listeners. My name is Brigg Leland. My company is Pivot Pass. We are based out of Richmond, Virginia and we are an employee wellness company.

We started in 2013 with when I say we, it was me and my life partner, April. And, yeah, it’s been a journey since then.

Peter: When did you start the company?

Brig: 2013. And we started it in Charlottesville, which is a small community. It’s gotten some recent press the past couple of years, but it’s where University of Virginia is. And it’s it’s about an hour away from where Richmond Virginia is and Richmond is it’s about a million plus people in the metro area so it’s a it’s not a large city but it’s it’s a pretty decent size. Mhmm.

Peter: So what what was the journey to starting that company? How did you end up, you know, starting the company in the first place?

Brig: The whole premise was that we wanted to make fitness easier. So when we started the company, the idea was that we’d be focusing on fitness, we’d be focusing on the individual, and we felt like there was a better way to make fitness easier by grouping some of the best gyms in the area, bringing them together as a as a network. And so what we offered was a a multi gym pass.

Peter: So fitness is a huge theme I hear. I think the the obvious next question is tell us about your your own personal fitness journey. I mean, it’s, not like you just had some interest in fitness. You thought, oh, this might be a good business idea. I mean, from what I know of you and the conversations we’ve had and I see you on Instagram, you seem like you are really into fitness.

So what’s that journey been like for you?

Brig: Well, it Peter, it probably makes sense to talk about April for a moment and how April and I got connected Uh-huh. Because that is really how the business evolves be as a result of our personal relationships. So April and I met up in Massachusetts. We met at an off shore course race. Okay.

She had a boyfriend at the time. Mhmm. So I became friends with her boyfriend and we we we met at that event. It wasn’t anything it wasn’t like it was a big deal. It really stuck in my memory.

And then, about two years later we remet and we remet at a triathlon and we met, at the finish line and I recognized her boyfriend who at the time was actually her ex and April came across the finish line and recognized me. Basically, our relationship started then and it just has has none has been ongoing ever since. So that was that was about seven years ago. And as our relationship got more serious, we were about two years into it. April took a job in Charlottesville and relocated there and we didn’t know if our relationship was going to last.

That long long distance relationship and we did it we we had a long distance relationship for I think it was like two or three years. You’d you’d have to ask April.

Peter: Okay.

Brig: But, you know, we had we had this long distance relationship, and then it it got to the point where it was time for me to make the decision about moving to Charlottesville or not. And when I did, it was at that point that we we decided that we wanted to start a business. Mhmm. I’ve always wanted to start a business. And her and I over the the course of our relationship have always written down different business ideas with the idea that at some point we would pursue one of them and a multi gym pass was one of our ideas.

It made sense at the time because we were seeing success in other markets like that ClassPass company. Mhmm. And and when we looked at when we looked at our true passions, we met in an unofficial course race, we remed at a triathlon, our first date was I kind of skipped over this, but our first date was Hurricane Irene. We did a Spartan race, then we went surfing in a hurricane, and April introduced me to surfing and

Peter: Crazy.

Brig: So that’s yeah. So like our our relationship has always revolved around fitness. We saw a problem that we wanted to solve and and so it was a natural fit. So does that does that answer? That’s a long way of answering your question.

Peter: Yeah. That’s that’s that’s great. How did you get into fitness?

Brig: I was always active as a kid and when I got out of college I realized that fitness was a key component to how how I felt as an individual and the confidence that I had and the success that I could bring to my job. And so I put fitness as a priority right off the bat upon graduation. And, ever since then, it’s it’s just been a part of my life. The other aspect of of working out is the the energy that it gives me. It is it is better than a gallon of coffee.

It is better than anything that I could do. And and I know this because when when I’m not active, let’s say I’m traveling or I take a couple days off, take a week off Mhmm. My my performance in every aspect of my life suffers. And so Mhmm. Even if it’s a thirty minute workout, it’s just, you know, breaking a sweat every day

Peter: Yep. Is

Brig: something that I try to do. It’s not Yep. Not perfect, but breaking a sweat could be twenty minutes. And you’ve broken a sweat, and that’s that’s kind of my, like, my bare minimum for each day. I like to do an early morning workout.

I found that my my body has a a good rhythm of waking up right around 05:00. I know that probably sounds really early for most people. If I try to do six or 7AM, I’m more sluggish. Mhmm. So 5AM works for me.

I I typically do a class workout. Mhmm. So I’ll go to a CrossFit gym or I’ll do

Peter: I’m very curious to kinda get a just a a summary or like a reader’s digest elevator idea of, you know, where you’re at with the company right now?

Brig: I think it probably makes sense just to start with the the premise that we’re a startup, which is is, a little bit different than what let’s just call it like a main street business. What what we what we’ve always wanted to do from the beginning is do something different than what’s been done. We’ve wanted to or we want to change the status quo. So when we when we started, it was about individual fitness. Mhmm.

The company and our mission of improving physical fitness has evolved, but we’re still at core focused on the individual’s health. Mhmm. So one of our mottos is, our our our primary motto is, we believe that when people are their health healthiest selves, they can live their most fulfilling lives or lives. Mhmm. That is at at core essence what pivot pivot task is.

That’s what we try to do is help people become their healthiest selves because they can they can have their best life. So when we were doing individual fitness passes, we had a couple of organizations come to us that said, can we just buy all of our members passes and we’ll, you know, we’ll pay for them all and then, you know, you can just administer them and and, you know, basically, it would be a benefit for our members. Could you do that? And it was first was it was a sorority at UVA. And we were like, really?

Well, sure. And overnight, we I think we doubled in size because they had a large sorority. Uh-huh. And that’s where the inkling started that maybe it makes more sense and we can make a bigger impact if we were to work with organizations. But that wasn’t solidified until an organization in Charlottesville reached out to us.

The organization is Apex Clean Energy and they do sustainable energy predominantly wind farms across The US and they over the course of a couple months they they wanted to work with us they wanted to they said that we were doing exactly what they were trying to do internally which was bring bring more fitness offerings, bring offer a benefit to their employees that that is unique. And anyways, we we started working with them and it just was a natural fit and we started to shift our services to be more employer focused or organizational focused because what we found was if we work well with organizations, we can really have an impact on more people’s lives versus working individual versus having, you know, going directly to the individual.

Peter: Right. So you can reach a broader audience quicker.

Brig: Yeah. And and and from an individual perspective, they’re getting the money from their employer. Mhmm. So so the employer is like, wanna give my employees the benefit that will help them be happy and engaged with our company. Mhmm.

And from our perspective, it’s perfectly in line with our mission. And I think we we reached so we started a corporate exclusive offering with Apex in January. Mhmm. And within the first couple of months, we achieved 75% participation in our program and they had by the way, they’ve they’ve doubled in size since we started working with them. So it’s kind of hard to know the number.

Yeah. They went from they went from about a 100 employees and now they’re well over 230, forty, fifty employees. So, you know, 75% engagement off of the first few months of working with us. They’re thrilled, we’re thrilled, we love working with, you know, these employees and and then our business has, you know, now we’re now we’ve optimized our business to, to help other companies like Apex achieve the same result.

Peter: So let me clarify one point. You you said you emphasized wellness. You’re a wellness company. So what do you mean by that?

Brig: We call it total wellness. It’s really a holistic approach to an individual. Our definition of wellness is definitely not the Webster’s dictionary definition. Alright. Alright.

Go. Our definition is, you know supporting an individual so that whether it’s stress or financial resources or fitness and nutrition or joy or it could be professional development to a certain extent. It’s really looking at the individual as a as a person and and supporting that that individual and all the all the kind of wellness and I put that in quotes that we can. And what we found is you know we started with fitness and we focus on fitness because that’s something that’s tangible, it’s easy to track, it drives down insurance costs but as our business grows, we’re expanding our services to include all of those different aspects. Mhmm.

Peter: So you said that you’re a startup. So I’m I’ve done a couple startups myself. I know that it’s kind of a harrowing experience at times. So what has been, what’s one big challenge that you overcame that you really felt was a was a huge success? Because I I realized in a startup, you have to kinda you have to sort of celebrate the successes along the way, you know, because you’re so so what what’s an example of one that you’ve we’re, you know, really proud of?

Brig: So in the startup world, there’s lots of different terms that get thrown at that they get used. And one of the terms is product market fit. If I were to start a plumbing business Mhmm. Product market fit is already defined. Yes.

Where, you know, I’m providing a service that is needed. I know who my clients are. I know exactly what they want. Mhmm. In our business, because we’re a startup, product market fit is is sometimes the hardest thing to achieve to to really figure out what is it that our customers want.

Mhmm. And when we made that transition from a individual wellness company to a corporate slash employee wellness company and we contracted with Apex, that’s by far the that’s when we we achieved product market fit and I think that that’s our our biggest success. Since then, it’s just led to more successes. So Mhmm. You know, it that that was a really important tipping point or milestone for us.

Peter: So how did you get there?

Brig: Well, and I think you’re referring to that shift from individual to corporate. Yeah. And Yeah. And Peter, you know, you were part of this journey. So it was it was definitely not a not a like, I woke up in the middle of the night and said, you know, this is what we’re doing.

Right. You know, Apex and and and and starting with a company was was great. It didn’t necessarily mean that we would get other organizations. Mhmm. And so we had to prove that to ourselves before before we could consider even going completely corporate.

Mhmm. But so so that just entailed meeting with as many employers. And when I mean employers, I we think about either the CEO or the director of HR, sometimes the CFO Mhmm. Of organizations that predominantly are are 200 people or more because those those organizations, offer health insurance to their employees. Mhmm.

Got it. So a lot of it was just, you know, having having as many meetings as we could and and seeing if what we what we designed and built out and and rolled out to Apex could fit these other organizations. And at the end of the day, it came back. The feedback that we got was absolutely. I I can’t I can’t think of another I can’t think of a company that gave us a hard no in terms of what you do is it has nothing to, you know I I have no interest in bringing what you do to our company.

Mhmm. So, you know, after hundreds of of meetings, I think that, you know, that’s that’s a pretty good sign that we are on the right track.

Peter: Yeah. So startup, what prepared you in your life? I mean, sounds like you went to school. What was, you know, what if anything was, you know, your preparation for the startup?

Brig: I love that question. So I grew up up in New England and my dad owned a construction company. And as a kid, I just watched my dad run his business. It wasn’t that large. He had anywhere from one to four employees working with him at a at any time.

And I remember being in the car and him driving around and being so proud of the work that he did. So we’d be, you know, driving to go get an oil change, and he’d he’d be like, on the way there, he’d point out different businesses that he’s done work for. And then we get to the car dealership, and he’s like he’s like, oh, yeah. You see all this, you know, you see this building right here, well I did these components. Mhmm.

And that had a pretty strong impact on me. And then my brother is he’s a couple years younger than me. He started his business and he started essentially right out of to a certain extent right out of high school. He was working in construction and was trained by somebody who said, know, hey, why don’t I help you start your own business? Mhmm.

And he started his fence company and it’s been incredibly successful since doing so and I would say that those two examples really inspired me to consider going out on my own. I had a my background to go back a little bit was I went to Boston University Business School and straight out of business school I went to work in real estate development and I got a really awesome opportunity to work on cutting edge projects. These were this was sustainability before it became a cool term. Mhmm. And we did we did some of the the coolest projects like the largest geothermal installation in The US or the largest photovoltaic installation.

It was just like it’s really cool and I love the fact that I was I was building something. Mhmm. But at the end of the day, was working for somebody else. Mhmm. I I love that job all the way until the the beginning of the recession and and and then let’s see I’m actually I I I decided like before this interview to bring out my resume so I get the dates right.

So at the 2007, I had to leave that company because it’s just the opportunities weren’t there. Yeah. And I went to work for a company that invests in those types of projects. Mhmm. I felt like I thought that my mission was going to be to become a developer one day and I wanted to learn the the hardest piece of developing a project and I felt like that was finance because obviously we were we were dealing with with with a with a financial crisis Mhmm.

At that time. And so anyways, long story short, I spent nine or ten years in the investment tax credit syndication debt side of of business and I worked with so many different entrepreneurs. I worked with, you know, one or two person companies all the way up to companies that are are in the news every day. Mhmm. And they all inspired me.

So when it came time to start the business, you know, we we chose April and I chose because she’s the we co founded the Pivot Path together. Mhmm. We chose something that we were both passionate about. Mhmm. And we wanted to build something.

We wanted to develop something that potentially nobody has ever seen before. Mhmm. So yeah.

Peter: Cool. So what was the biggest surprise in starting the business?

Brig: Oh my gosh. I think what we weren’t anticipating was we we thought that we knew what customers wanted. It it goes back to that product market fit. Mhmm. Then regardless of how much research we do or prospect interaction or whatever it may be to a better understand our customers.

There’s you know, we we just were constantly surprised by the sophistication of people. I mean, people are unique and special and we just have to remind ourselves that, you know, I guess it’s just been a journey to make sure that that we’re we’re fulfilling the needs, we’re helping people and if we can do that every and it changes. We always have to be on our toes with it. Mhmm. That’s been the most surprising is that, you know, I thought that we would build a technology platform that would make it easy for people to go work out.

Mhmm. And, you know, that’s not where we are today. Right. That’s one component, but it’s, you know, people are complex and Mhmm. And if we really wanna fulfill on our mission, we we have to continue to innovate.

So it’s been it’s it’s fun. I love the challenge of it, but that’s the most surprising, I would say.

Peter: So so what advice would you have for somebody who’s in, like, a corporate job right now, somebody who’s in their twenties or thirties, and they’re like, you know what? I think I wanna do this startup thing.

Brig: The advice that I got and it actually it’s it’s really relevant to this but it it actually brings me back to when I was trying to decide what I was gonna do after college. Mhmm. The advice that I got was what is your dream job fifteen or twenty years from now? Like, where do you envision yourself? Mhmm.

And then say, why can’t I do that today? And so at that time, I really loved real estate. I really loved development. So I was I was thinking I needed to do, like, a long term ten year path from college, you know, get get three or four intro jobs to get to be a developer. And this person said, why can’t you just do that right out of college?

And logically, I I end up working for a developer, but Mhmm. But I would give the same advice to someone who’s who’s interested in starting a business. Whether it’s a start up or a main street business. Mhmm. I would I would say if that’s your goal, you have to do that now.

Mhmm. Can’t think about tomorrow, you can’t think about, you know, months from now.

Peter: Yep.

Brig: I I kinda regret that I didn’t do the transition sooner. I thought I thought that I thought that I needed to have capital. I needed to have a lot of savings to start a business. Mhmm. I also thought that I needed experience.

So I spent, you know, ten years working for different organizations trying to gain experience and don’t get me wrong, it was beneficial. But I don’t think I I would have done that. I don’t I I think that the experience that you acquire is just on the job. It’s getting your hands dirty. Right.

And and the funding piece of it is, you know, of course, sure that your that you can support your personal life and whether that’s a family or or just you as an individual, make sure that you can support that. But there if you wanna start a business, there are so many funding resources out there, especially for for people who are in the early stages of starting a business. Mhmm. I think I think later, like, where where we are right now, it’s it’s a little bit of a different story, but, you know, there’s there’s there’s SBA loans, there’s raising money for a business through friends and family or angel investors. Anyways, that’s that would be my advice is if you have that goal, the sooner you can do it, the the better off you’ll be, the happier off you’ll be.

And for all I know, Pivot Pass, you know, ten years from now could be completely different. I may not even be affiliated with the organization. Mhmm. But I can promise you one thing. I will I will never go back to the corporate world.

I will I will I will always be I I I I think that I will always be, you know, in the startup scene or, you know, kind of leading my own destiny Right. From a business perspective. Yeah.

Peter: One or two folks that have mentored you or just inspired you from afar that you like to pay attention to and really, you know, sort of follow their advice?

Brig: I mean, I think at the end of the day, it’s it’s about surrounding yourself with with people that not only you trust, but that are just smarter, maybe more experienced or Mhmm. You look up to in in different aspects. Right. One of the reasons why I felt really comfortable starting the business with April is it besides we’re life partners, she has all the strengths I don’t. And hopefully, have some strengths she doesn’t.

Peter: Right.

Brig: It’s so and I and and as we started or when we started the business, we were not affiliated with any incubator or accelerator programs but what what we’ve learned is that by joining those types of groups we’ve now been part of two that they help tremendously in providing resources through their mentor their mentor directory so that if I need help in any area of our business I can I can leverage those? And over the past few years, I can I can name off, you know, several mentors from Charlottesville and and we were part of UVA’s iLab program there and that was absolutely instrumental in getting us to where we are today and now we’re in Richmond and we’re part of Startup Virginia and just the resources, the people, the connections and it it’s it’s made our success tenfold than what it would have been without? So I would just suggest that, you know, it doesn’t it’s not like there’s a like there’s a formula. I I just think that if if you if you’re interacting with somebody that that you look up to in in a particular area, let you know, like, remember that next time you have an issue in that area, you you know, reach out to that contact.

Mhmm. You know, it’s all about relationship. It’s all about Right. D to d. Yep.

So

Peter: Yep. That’s true. So what about books? Are there any books or authors that you that inspire you or, you know?

Brig: I chuckle because, of course, what brought us together was story branding.

Peter: Absolutely. So,

Brig: you know, Donald Miller, that book that book really explains how I was trying I was trying to figure out marketing in the Donald Miller way and I didn’t I couldn’t figure out why I was not happy with the traditional marketing and advertising. Mhmm. And just going through the story branding process is just it’s just perfectly in line with what we try to do as a business. And Mhmm. But other books, you know, I’m reading let’s see.

I just bought LitScaling and I started reading that with the co founder of LinkedIn, Reid Hoffman. I’m reading Essentialism as well. That’s a great great book.

Peter: Yes. Definitely.

Brig: Like being able to focus on, you know, fewer but more important aspects and that’s actually changed how my day to day work is I I used to, you know, when you when you start a business and, Peter, you know, you’re you’re the you’re the janitor as well as the, you know, every and you’re everything.

Peter: Mhmm. Bookkeeper, accountant.

Brig: Bookkeeper. And if if your business is gonna grow, if it’s going to scale, obviously, can’t do everything. But it’s hard to let go. And so my role has has definitely been better defined through by by taking practices outlined in that book. And then Ray Dalio’s book and I’m I’m just googling it.

I think it’s called fundamentals. Principles. Principles. Thank you. Yeah.

That’s an amazing book to, you know, he they’re his life and business principles. And he’s an extremely successful hedge fund manager but also just some philanthropist and anyways a family person and that’s been inspiring as well. I would say those those are kind of my top three or four. I mean, of course we have the the the Gary Deez and Tim Ferriss and Yeah. I can list, you know, dozens of other books but those really stick out.

Peter: Right. Right. Great. What was the one by Reid Hoffman? What was that called again?

Brig: I think yeah. Blitzscaling.

Peter: Blitzscaling. Okay. He has a great podcast as well. Yeah. Does.

It’s called what’s it called? Masters of scale?

Brig: Exactly.

Peter: We’ll put links to all these books in the, show notes if anybody wants to find those Yeah. On Amazon. So so so what about, you know, let’s step away from business and all that and fitness. You know? So what other things inspire you just in your, day to day life?

I mean, you know, we’ve got business. We’ve got fitness. I mean, that’s kind of a two dimensional view of our lives. What are the other dimensions of your life?

Brig: Well, April and I have two awesome kids. I probably shouldn’t call our 17 year old a kid. We have just you know two awesome kids that are really you know they’re individual, they’re they are fun, they are awesome, they Peter you met Athena and Athena is brilliant and she inspires me every day. We went yesterday we we I I left work a little early which is a really great thing to do and Athena doesn’t have her license. So she was like I’ve never driven a car.

Would you take me into, you know, some sort of parking lot? Yeah. And so we did that experience yesterday and it was just thrilling. It was the best part of my day yesterday.

Peter: Mhmm. Fun.

Brig: So yeah, I mean that’s for for me, for April, it’s it’s about family. It’s about whether it’s my family up in New England, whether it’s our kids or April’s family which is in Tulsa. Mhmm. They’re they’re really important to us. Every single one of them.

So Mhmm. Mhmm. Yeah. That’s that’s kind of it. I I don’t know what else I could spend time on.

Yeah. Or or or said differently, we don’t have a lot of time in, you know, in today’s current society. So that’s that’s what I spend my time on.

Peter: You’ve got you got a lot of responsibilities. So how would you define life done well?

Brig: My gosh. It’s balance. And I’m learning that or I’m trying to learn that right now. It’s it’s and I I haven’t thought about this question beforehand, so I’m kinda formulating as I as I talk, but it’s if once you identify your priorities, if if you can if you can balance those. So if my top priorities are my family, my business, and my personal health or fitness Mhmm.

Then it’s just fine in the bath. I can’t put, you know, I it’s just I guess sometimes the business can take over my life and everything else suffers and so in my mind it’s just it’s just finding that balance and making sure that my priorities are straight and I know that that’s probably like quintessential or pretty obvious but I’ll give you an example so I we didn’t talk about this for too much in detail but I block my time based on those priorities.

Peter: Okay.

Brig: So so I know that during the day can it’s it’s predominantly during a workday business. So Mhmm. So I make sure that, you know, when there when it’s when it’s non business time so let’s say the business time is nine to five, give or take. Mhmm. Then then before nine and after five, it’s the other two priorities.

Peter: Okay.

Brig: And as long as I separate them like that Yeah. Then I’m able to make sure that I can be full fully focused on the kids or fully focused on other family or in the mornings when nobody’s up at 05:00, I can be fully focused on my fitness.

Peter: Mhmm. So what are the things that you look for when you are considering, you know, hiring somebody?

Brig: April loves the term gumption. So Mhmm. Gumption is, you know, someone who is willing to pick up a project and run with it. Yep. There’s there’s trust behind gumption.

There’s there’s a lot of description behind gumption. But that’s like that’s that’s a term that we continue to go back to when we think about hiring someone. The other one is we do not use traditional hiring practices, I would say. What I mean by that is we we leverage our relationships with others. So Right.

We’ll reach out to folks in our network because they’re people that we can trust. And if they’re gonna recommend somebody for a particular position with us, then that’s that’s gonna be much more important than than a cold lead from website or whatnot.

Peter: Right. So word-of-mouth referrals.

Brig: Yeah. I mean, you know, that’s how we found you.

Peter: Exactly. That’s how we met. Yeah. That’s true. That’s true.

Brig: So every everybody that we’ve hired has come through that type of process. Mhmm. And that’s why we try to build a big network of people that we trust so that when we send out a request, you know, we have a lot of people that we can that we could potentially get responses back from. Mhmm. Whether it’s hiring or Right.

Anything.

Peter: Yeah. Yeah. That’s good. That’s good. That’s I love that word gumption.

It’s kind of, it’s it’s got the can do. I wrote down in my notes here, can do. Scrappiness. Scrappiness, resourcefulness, resilient, moxie. You know?

I can I I can see that type of person and knowing the types of folks that you work with, I see that that fits fits their description as well? What else do we need to know about you, Brig?

Brig: What comes to mind is that everybody knows everybody who knows me knows that I I don’t generally wear a shirt unless I’m in the office. So I’m I’m I’m often known as as shirtless, but the reason one of the reasons why I do that, of course, is because I’m often active and sweating and whatnot.

Peter: And and you’re and if you’ve seen any pictures, you’d know that you’re pretty ripped. But

Brig: Thanks. Appreciate that, but I’m I’m healthy, relatively. But the other reason why I do it now, because it’s changes that matured, is is that I really just wanna embrace what makes me happy and and and inspire somebody else to kind of step out of the line with everybody. What I mean by the line with everybody is, you know, in general, you know, you have a 100 people, everybody’s, you know, most of the people are standing in a particular way Mhmm. Whatever.

And Yeah. And and if if I can help inspire somebody to take their, you know, take their proverbial shirt off and be be unique and do what makes them happy. Pursue those things that hopefully will ultimately lead them to success. That that’s why I do it nowadays. I inspired somebody this morning.

It was great. He he was like he was like hey you inspired me to take my shirt off and I know that that’s like a very physical thing but all of a sudden now he’s working out with a group of a 100 people and he’s he’s he’s not part he’s not just, you know, he doesn’t necessarily fit into the mold. Right. And I I I kinda love that.

Peter: Right.

Brig: I know one other story, I guess, is that, so my family came to The United States, right around the Mayflower and every every generation on my father’s side Mhmm. Since then, has had an entrepreneur. And Wow. So it’s been inspiring to watch my dad, my brother, all those previous companies. We’re talking oil companies, paper companies, just like random, but, you know, kind of the core businesses at that time, the industrial revolution and

Peter: Yeah.

Brig: All of that. Yeah. It’s it’s it’s something that I that I always had wanted to do when I had a corporate career. Making the transition was the hardest decision. Mhmm.

But despite the ups and downs and the struggle like you just described, and I wouldn’t I wouldn’t change it for anything. I just would have done it sooner.

Peter: That’s, that’s good advice. Yeah. Yeah. I I feel some of that myself, having started my own company at 51, having done some startups as well, but, was with cofounders and others and was not like the, you know, the the the core founder, I guess, if you will. So it’s great advice.

Well, Brig, I really appreciate your time today, and I’ll put some links to Pivot Pass and, you know, some of the other the Instagram and some of the other links. I’ll put those in the show notes if folks wanna check out the business pivot pass and follow them on Instagram. And, well, there’s some contact information we’ll have there too if somebody just wants to find out more about your company and, you know, how you might be able to help them. So I really appreciate it.

Brig: Yeah. Thank you for having me. This has been has been a great experience and I’m really excited to see how your how this podcast evolves over time. It’ll be exciting to potentially come back in six months and we can talk about other stuff.

Peter: Exactly. Yep. Yep. You’re on the rotation. I

Brig: wish you a a ton of success, and I appreciate you inviting me. And yeah. No. By the way, no shirtless photos on on the the Instagram, whatever you put out there. Cheese.

Peter: Alright, Brig. Alright. Say hi to April. Take care.

Brig: Will do. Thank you, Peter. Bye.

Peter: Yep. Bye bye. Thanks for listening to this episode of Biz and Life Done Well with Peter Wilson. You can subscribe to us on iTunes, Google Podcasts, Spotify, and most of the other popular podcast platforms. Please tell your friends about us and leave us a review so even more people will find out about us.

Thanks again. We’ll see you soon.